Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

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Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby JimSa » Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:14 am

I'm looking for some advice on mounting Look Pivot P14s on Hart F17 WC mogul skis. I am 5'11" and 180lbs. I went back and forth between the 175cm and 168cm ski. Ultimately, I opted for the 168cm which is slightly short. I haven't skied the bumps in years but long ago I could shred pretty good... I'm over 40 now and I'm hoping that I can get back to skiing the zipperline. So, I went for the 168 to slow me down just a little.

The standard recommendation for mounting on these skis is +2cms forward. However, since I went slightly short, I'm wondering if I should calibrate that a little bit and do something like +1 cm? Or should I just stick with +2? Anyone have any advice here?

Oh, and since I haven't mounted the skis yet... let me know if you think I made a big mistake by going with the 168cm vs the 175cm WC. I'm a little unsure of my length choice and my reasoning about slowing me down just a little...
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby Jeffy » Sun Mar 07, 2010 1:52 pm

JimSa wrote:I'm looking for some advice on mounting Look Pivot P14s on Hart F17 WC mogul skis. I am 5'11" and 180lbs. I went back and forth between the 175cm and 168cm ski. Ultimately, I opted for the 168cm which is slightly short. I haven't skied the bumps in years but long ago I could shred pretty good... I'm over 40 now and I'm hoping that I can get back to skiing the zipperline. So, I went for the 168 to slow me down just a little.

The standard recommendation for mounting on these skis is +2cms forward. However, since I went slightly short, I'm wondering if I should calibrate that a little bit and do something like +1 cm? Or should I just stick with +2? Anyone have any advice here?

Oh, and since I haven't mounted the skis yet... let me know if you think I made a big mistake by going with the 168cm vs the 175cm WC. I'm a little unsure of my length choice and my reasoning about slowing me down just a little...


I think you went too short. The 175cm would be great for your height and weight.
-Jeff
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby Blanton » Sun Mar 07, 2010 9:56 pm

I just mounted up a pair of the Rossi moguls in a 167 with the turntable bindings (shaped more like the Hart Classic). I'm your height and about 155. I was very skeptical of the entire setup coming off of a 180 Volkl and actually ended up really liking everything. If you're skiing smaller course style moguls they will work even better. I would put your boots on and play with the mounting point to get a feel for everything before you get them mounted up (regardless of length).
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby JimSa » Mon Mar 08, 2010 10:43 pm

Blanton wrote:I just mounted up a pair of the Rossi moguls in a 167 with the turntable bindings (shaped more like the Hart Classic). I'm your height and about 155. I was very skeptical of the entire setup coming off of a 180 Volkl and actually ended up really liking everything. If you're skiing smaller course style moguls they will work even better. I would put your boots on and play with the mounting point to get a feel for everything before you get them mounted up (regardless of length).

I got about 25-30 lbs on you though... That's an additional 20% body mass, and the length difference is 4%. Checking here and other sources, the consensus is that I went to small. I opted to exchange for the 175cm.

I've been advised a couple times now to get a feel for them in different positions before I mount. I wish I understood that. I'm wondering if I'm missing some trick. How do you truly get the feel for a position without skiing it? How do you ski it without mounting it? I don't get it... Is there some sort of rockerboard trick to try it in the living room?

Thanks all for your advice and suggestions.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby CometKat » Tue Mar 09, 2010 10:40 am

This is what WC alpine skiers do and what I do for all of my skis that I mount. It’s called BOF on center. First, mark the ball of your foot on the outside of your boot. Next, mark the center of the running surface of your ski (rockered skis throw everything off). Now mount your bindings with the ball of the foot on the center of the running surface. This will usually be pretty close to the factory mark. Of course the factory is estimating your foot size. My last pair of skis, a 2008 K2 Crossfire carving ski, ended up 12mm forward of the line. My Cabrawlers ended up 41mm forward of the line but the tips are slightly rockered so I had to guess a little. Let me know if you want me to elaborate on any of these marks.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby JimSa » Sat Mar 13, 2010 3:29 am

I ended up mounting the F17 WC at +2cm from line. Using BoF measure, this was still almost 1cm shy of an exact BoF mount. I guess I was surprised that the mount line on a mogul ski would be this far back. You'd have to have some seriously wierd feet for it to ever be center... No matter though...
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby CometKat » Sat Mar 13, 2010 10:06 am

JimSa wrote: I guess I was surprised that the mount line on a mogul ski would be this far back.

Maybe the shorter tail helps if you over rotate a back flip.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby mjanulaitis » Sat Jan 22, 2011 10:47 am

Well just mounted up some F17s and I think the position is too far back. Prior to mounting I talked with Hart and they said their team members were mounting anywhere from +6 to +1. The person I talked with was an older bump skier and he mounts his skis +1. Since I'm now old at 37 that sounded good but I don't think I like it. I feel like the skis are too long up front...even though they are the shortest skis I've ever been on. I only skied on them one day so I think I'll give them a few more days. If I don't like them, I'll probably re-mount +2.5 to +3. Hopefully that doesn't compromise the skis.

Where did you find out the 'standard' was +2cm? As far as I can tell there is no documentation on their web site. These are hand made and my ski number is 430 so that tells me there aren't too many made. I would expect each ski is placed in a jig and then marked where the optimal mount location is. There is quite a bit of engineering that goes into making these skis so it makes little sense to me that a reputable manufacturer would knowingly mark the boot center is a less than optimal location for a recreational skier.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby skiking » Sun Jan 23, 2011 5:07 pm

Here is the latest mounting recommendation from Hart as of 10/2010. On the world cups they are saying
74.3cm from the tail on the 168 or 77.5cm from the tail on the 175.

This is to be for the boot center. on the 175 it looks like 2-3 cm forward of the factory mark.

I think it is absolutely ridiculous that they can't get the mounting point right on the skis themselves......especially for the price they charge. In addition they don't have the revised mounting positions easily accessible on there website.

My buddy has the f 17 classic in a 180 and I tried it and thought it was awful......he has since had them remounted forward and it is a totally different ski.

I just got a pair of the world cups in a 175 and will be getting them mounted this week and trying them in Big Sky. Curious how they will compare to my 182 twisters.

Does anyone have any recommendations on how far back to dull the tips and tails on these skis? On my twisters I dulled about 4" past the contact points (towards the bindings) and it seems to work fine.

christopher

tried to attach the hart mounting file but it won't let me
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby mondeo » Mon Jan 24, 2011 10:59 am

Gotta say, I'm a little surprised that people are saying the mount point on the harts are too far back. I've got the 180s, and the extra length over the 175 Volkl walls and 173 K2s is in the tail, when I line up toe pieces with a couple of my friend's skis. It's almost a center mount.

As far as complaining about where the line is placed, maybe it's because every mogul ski gets mounted forward? So ehen you go from a K2 where you want it mounted +2 you also want a Twister or F17 mounted +2.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby Jeffy » Mon Jan 24, 2011 6:58 pm

mondeo wrote:Gotta say, I'm a little surprised that people are saying the mount point on the harts are too far back. I've got the 180s, and the extra length over the 175 Volkl walls and 173 K2s is in the tail, when I line up toe pieces with a couple of my friend's skis. It's almost a center mount.

As far as complaining about where the line is placed, maybe it's because every mogul ski gets mounted forward? So ehen you go from a K2 where you want it mounted +2 you also want a Twister or F17 mounted +2.


Mounting marks from the factory are all over the place, even on mogul skis. The K2 mark is biased too far aft and the Twister mark seems perfect. In relation to each skis overall length, the K2 is about 2.5-3cm biased aft compared to the Twister. One really needs to learn what position they like to ski and always measure for that on new skis. Never trust the factory mark.
-Jeff
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby fogman » Sun Jan 22, 2012 9:51 pm

I have the Hart F-17 Classic, 175 cm, unmounted. Is the mounting position the same for the Classic as for the WC? Could you post the mounting chart as Hart has removed it from their web site and it is now only available to dealers.

I have the Look Pivot/Rossignol FKS jig and like to mount my own skis. Our local ski shop here has a reputation for mounting bindings incorrectly (wrong position/stripped screws/screws pulling out). Plus, they charge $50.00 for this!
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby rondo320 » Tue Jan 31, 2012 9:31 pm

My 168 cm classics bought in May '08 were mounted 1 cm forward and they seem right to me. My 175 WCs, new this season, are mounted 1 1/2 cm forward and I think I should have gone probably about 3 cms forward. I would suggest you go with the BOF mounting described in this thread. It seems like the best advice other than trying out different mounting positions yourself which is impossible without ruining the skis.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby Blanton » Wed Feb 01, 2012 9:57 pm

Based on the distance from tail measurement I went forward 2.5 on the 175 WC (I don't have the actual number handy). Having skied them about 30 days this season I would probably bump them forward a tiny bit more if I were to start from scratch. While it sucks they aren't marked correctly from the factory the dealer does have a good guide and it seems to have worked fairly well for me.
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Re: Binding Mount Position for Hart F17 WC Mogul

Postby vmpatterson » Sun Feb 12, 2012 11:52 pm

I just got the F17 Classic 167cm and after seeing the comments did a bit of research and measuring. In the hart ski.com/infocentral.html site I found a pdf with the recommended mounting positions for all hart skis. For the Classic 167cm's it said 74.3 cm from the tails. This is 3.1-3.2 cm forward of the center boot line on the skis.

I then determined the center of the running surface and marked this point. When I placed the ski boot on the ski with the ball of the foot on this line the center of the boot line was right on top of the 74.3 cm line. Seems like I have agreement.

I haven't mounted the binding yet (waiting for the mail to arrive with new my bindings and an 80mm brake) so can't say how they ski but thought I would add my two cents.

The position recommended for F17 Wc 175cm was 77.5 cm from the tail but I would also recommend doing a ball of the foot measurement for comparison.
Last edited by vmpatterson on Wed Feb 15, 2012 11:30 am, edited 1 time in total.
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